Episode Transcript
[00:00:07] Speaker A: Hi, and welcome to the unveiling. I'm Tim, one of the hosts, along with Ajay and Mark. We are three guys discussing the one true gospel. We hope you're encouraged by this episode. Let's dive right in.
Hello, and yes, welcome back to the unveiling. I got a surprise for y'. All. We got rid of Mark tonight.
It doesn't happen nearly enough. Ajay, you and I need more. More room to breathe in these things, you know what I mean?
Now, Mark's got some.
Some things he need to take care of today. He. He's been in the process of moving, so I'm sure there's, you know how that is. Everything's up in the air, I'm sure, at this point. So, Ajay, we're going to carry on without him, and we're going to go ahead and move forward. And I think that today. Let's talk about the other day. I had a post in my daily blog about sanctification, holiness in the light of grace. And I used a sentence here that we then had a marvelous. The three of us had a marvelous discussion on text over for, like, hours. I'm not sure how long that took, but I said grace doesn't make holiness optional.
It makes it possible.
And I kind of agreed with some of the things that were being said in that. I think it was a misstatement on my part.
When we are saved, we are saved and sanctified, made holy all at the same time. Now, it may take us time to walk into that sanctification and, and look more holy on the outside, but inside, all that work is already done. Or have I already started messing up the definitions that we're going to be working with tonight? Ajay?
[00:02:03] Speaker B: No, no, I think. Good. You're. You're good, Tim.
First, I want to say we miss Mark and we hope to that he will join us soon next time. But, you know, by God's grace, we will continue today.
Yeah. So I think, Tim, I don't think you messed it up. Holiness, sanctification, you know, in the context of this podcast, we are not actually going into the real Greek definition of holiness and sanctification, but for the context of this podcast, you know, how do we. Now that we are saved? Like, how do we. It's about living a life that is pleasing to God. Right. You know, that's what we mean by holiness and sanctification. But at the same time, to your point, when we received our salvation, we receive everything. Because the Bible says in First Corinthians, Chapter 1 of God Ye are in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us.
Righteousness, sanctification, wisdom, redemption, right? What we received in our salvation is Christ himself.
And we did not receive parts of Christ, we received all of Christ.
And Christ is our sanctification and he is our holiness. So we received all of it.
And like you said, you know, we grow in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
We grow in the knowledge of the treasures we have in Christ. But we already received everything when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ.
[00:03:36] Speaker A: Amen. Absolutely.
And I think I want to touch on one other little point about that.
And I know you said we don't want to do a whole lot of definitions, but let's at least make this point because I grew up in a church that said, basically my holiness is only achieved through my sanctification and I had to work for my sanctification, right? So as far as the, the church that we grew in, that effort driven church that we grew up in, sanctification got thrown on us, okay? So it was our work to do to achieve holiness, but God gave us that holiness right up front. We're white, we're pure, we're like driven snow.
There's no sin on us, we're truly forgiven things like that right away. And that's great because, you know, I couldn't save myself. What makes me think I could sanctify myself in the long run? No.
[00:04:30] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Again, I think, Tim, it all goes back to right, not realizing the finished work.
And normally what they say is, okay, now you got to sanctify or you need to grow in your sanctification.
And the way to do that is law, right? They tell you, okay, you do this, don't do this, do this, don't do this. They basically put us squarely back under the law, the Ten Commandments and the law of Moses.
And what they're saying is if you try hard enough, you will be sanctified. And at least, you know, the way I heard is like, you know, you basically keep trying harder. And they also acknowledge that, okay, you know, it's not going to happen all at once, but the more you try to obey the law, the better you get. You know, that's the essence.
But the problem is, we know in Romans 7, Paul is clear about that, the more you try to keep the law, the worse it becomes.
So it's basically like, you know, you are.
It's almost like, you know, you don't lose your salvation, right? But the analogy that comes to mind is there is a guy who is Stuck in quagmire. Right. You know, you can't get out of it. And someone throws a rope and then pulls them out of the quagmire and then right after that, throws them back and tells them, okay, yeah, you need to work now. You know, that's what they're doing, if that makes sense.
[00:05:55] Speaker A: No, it does, it does. But I, and I don't mean to make light here, but this throws me back into a thing. You know, growing up, I was convinced that quicksand was going to be much more of a problem than it's turned out to be because all of the old sitcoms had quicksand as a plot one time or another. But no, the, the whole idea is, even if you find yourself in, let's say you find yourself in quicksand or a quagmire or whatnot, they tell you, don't struggle, you're just not going to. You're not, only you not going to get out. Yeah, you're going to continue to sink.
So, you know, if it works that way in nature, I'm going to assume God's going to work that way, too.
[00:06:33] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great analogy, Tim. You know, if you're in quicksand, quagmire, whatever you want to call it, the harder you try to get out of it, the more you'll sink.
And the only way is try not to do anything until someone saves you. And, and in fact, you know, that's what happened during our salvation. Right. We couldn't save ourselves, Lord Jesus Christ, by grace. You know, we are saved without any of our works. And now that we are saved, you know, it's like we are now walking on a solid ground.
We are not on quicksand anymore unless you put yourself back in it. And the way to put yourself back in the quicksand is through the law.
So these people, holiness people, they really don't have a solution.
They kind of.
What is the right term? Right. You know, they just say it as if, you know, it is grace, but basically they are sugar coating it and putting us back under the law. They don't have a solution. They just say, okay, you try hard to obey the law and one day you will be sanctified. Or they also say that, okay, yeah, sanctification, entire full sanctification is not possible, but you need to try hard enough. When you do that, you will slowly, over time, progressively become more and more sanctified.
Right?
[00:07:57] Speaker A: Yep. And I mean, Paul warns us of the fact that he says, hey, having started in grace, who's fooled you. Having started in grace, do you think you're going to get out of it now by doing good works or continue it by doing good works? We can't. We couldn't do it in the first place. Why do we think we can do it in the second place? I can't.
[00:08:14] Speaker B: Yep. So, yeah, Tim.
Well, I think before we go there, you know, I just want to point us to two scriptures. We talk about this several times, but I think we, several times we tell, you know, grace doesn't enable sin in our life. In fact, you know, grace is the only way of living above sin in our life. But, you know, without scriptures, you know, we don't talk about anything. So I just want to quickly point to two things.
You know, Romans is a book, right, you know, where Paul systematically lays out step by step. And many of men of God, many theologians, they tell us, you know, in order to be grounded in Christianity, you need to understand Romans, because Roman Romans, it talks about start to finish. It starts with unbelievers, and then it goes into how we are saved. And then it goes into the big picture, like, you know, the problem of humanity, right? It goes all the way to Adam and talks about why we are in this condition.
And then after that he goes into how to live a life of grace.
So I want to go to Romans chapter 5.
Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand.
So that's what happened after. Before we are saved, we were under the law, we were not under grace, but after we are saved, after we put our faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. It says, having been justified.
That's a past tense. You know, the justification is a done deal.
We have peace with God, and then by the same faith by which we are justified, we have access into this grace.
The term access is entrance. It's like, you know, you have entered this room called grace before you were outside the room. Now we have entry and it's talking about we have already entered and we are standing on grace ground. So the first thing I wanted to say is after we are saved, we come into grace, we leave the law, and then we come into grace.
And in Romans 6:14, we often quote this verse as well.
Romans 6:14 says, it is very, very plain.
[00:10:42] Speaker A: Here
[00:10:44] Speaker B: I am trying to get there. Give me one second. Romans 6:14, Sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under the law, but under grace. So what Paul is saying is for those who are saved. He is saying that it's a plain blanket statement.
You are not under the law, but under grace.
And he is simply saying if you are under grace, sin will not have dominion over you. So if someone says grace will lead you to sin, grace is a license to sin.
Grace will cause you to sin more. They are totally contradicting the plain statement of Paul. He's simply saying two things here now. You're not under the law, you're under grace. And because you are under grace, sin will not have dominion over you.
Sin cannot be your master anymore.
[00:11:35] Speaker A: No, no, absolutely not. And I gotta bring up a point. I bring this up every once in a while. I don't think it can be said enough because I don't think it gets heard enough. There's two reasons why we're not under the law, Jay. Did you realize that? The first one, of course, is the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ is the one and for all sacrifice for our sin.
But the second one is, I don't happen to be of the tribe of Israel. I'm not Jewish. The law was written for the Jews.
It never was meant for anyone else. So we aren't supposed to be under it. So we have those two things that justify our freedom from the law.
Now what happens when Jesus comes, comes and we accept him and we get filled with the Holy Spirit?
The Spirit takes over leading our lives, more or less. He's not a taskmaster. He's not giving us a list of new rules. He's not, you know, trying to. He's not standing behind us telling us, no, you didn't do that right? Do it better, do it harder, do it more. No, he's not. He's the one who's still in quiet and leading us into the right path. He's, you know, he's. He's filling our thoughts and our mind and changing our mind daily, Renewing our mind daily. And then, you know, so these are the things that all work together to say it changes me. It. It changes my life. You know, I turn away. Repentance is turning around. Turning away, right? I've turned away and around from my old life. I'm now living in the spirit led life. And he's leading me to better and greater things in Christ. Not of myself, because I don't have a self to be proud of.
[00:13:17] Speaker B: Exactly, Tim. Yeah. So, Tim, I really liked the post you made the other day on Facebook. Why? Grace produces holiness.
I wonder, you know, if we can go into that a little bit.
[00:13:30] Speaker A: Well, we can certainly try. Ajay, I wrote that three days ago. I'm not sure my brain actually remembers that far back anymore.
I'm not like you.
So let me. Let me just pull up a little cheater note here so I know what I'm. What I'm thinking about saying.
Okay.
Yeah, I actually pulled up the post. That's great.
Yeah. So where do you want to start with this one, Ajay?
[00:14:00] Speaker B: I would like to start from the beginning. You know, the example you gave, I thought it's very simple and succinct and it conveys really deep message, so.
[00:14:10] Speaker A: Oh, very simple. So that works for me.
[00:14:13] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:14:14] Speaker A: All right. So, yeah, I was. I wrote here that when I was much younger, I didn't respond well to rules or authority. I always bristled. The idea of being controlled, of not being able to be myself or do what I wanted. And honestly, I think this is how many people experience Christianity, Christianity as just another control system for their lives.
In many cases, that's exactly how it's presented from the pulpit.
Some people. Excuse me. So people end up trying to accept Christianity as a behavior modification system instead of a relationship, a structure for managing conduct, rather than a life rooted in love.
[00:14:58] Speaker B: Yeah. Chim, if I can stop here real quick before we go forward. I think that is so true, Right. The words that you used, two words that struck me. Behavior modification system and a structure for managing conduct. Think of it, right? You basically, I mean, what is the difference? Even before you were saved, you are more or less doing the same thing because your conscience is still pricking you every time you sin or you do something bad, you were doing the same thing. You were trying to control your behavior.
You were trying to manage your conduct even according to worldly standards. We know that if we don't manage our conduct, we are not going to get anywhere. You can't just go to work and start being rude to people, just slapping people around or go with the alcohol bottle to work. You can't do that, right. Even before being saved, we were doing the same thing because we knew, okay, there is a problem with us, right. You know, there's something inherently wrong and I need to manage it. But when we are saved, we are actually delivered from that behavior modification system because like you said, we have become a new creature in Christ. Right. Before, we didn't have the Holy Spirit. You know, many people think the difference between an unbeliever and a believer is conducting. Oh, unbelievers don't do that. And now that I'm a believer, sorry, unbelievers. Do X, Y and Z.
And now as a believer, I don't. Okay, Even we even say, okay, before I used to drink like crazy. Now I don't do that. Before I used to do this, Now I don't do that. That's how they see Christian versus non Christian. But the difference between a non believer and a believer is the Holy Spirit.
They don't have the Holy Spirit, but we have the Holy Spirit. So if you go back to behavior modification system and you put Christian back under it, basically what you are saying is, okay, now I have to manage the behavior of the Holy Spirit.
I need to manage the conduct of Christ in me. How ridiculous it is, right?
So that's why it doesn't really apply to Christians.
[00:17:23] Speaker A: Well, and I think people look at the testimonies and the stories of people who say, yeah, I used to do. I used to drink too much and now I don't drink at all. Well, okay? So people from the outside look that and go, yeah, but I like a drink once in a while, man. I don't want to have to go through. I don't have to give something up. I don't want to have to let go of stuff. More rules, more regulations, you know, do this, don't do that.
In fact, some public pulpits actually emphasize it by saying, hey, if you're busy doing the things you should do, you won't have enough time to do the things you shouldn't. Just.
And they tell you, this is how you're supposed to manage your life.
If I could have done that, I could have saved myself.
[00:18:01] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And the other side is Tim, I'm talking about this specific example.
Oh, I used to drink, now I don't. But there are many unbelievers who don't drink at all. If you just purely think in terms of conduct, probably some of them have better conduct than Christians. So you're basically telling them, yeah, you don't need Christ because you already have good behavior. If it is all about behavior, many people don't even need Christ.
So what unbelievers don't have and we have is life.
Salvation is all about life and spirit and righteousness. No matter how good you are outwardly. But you don't have these three things. You don't have righteousness, you don't have spirit, you don't have life.
And that is the essence of Christianity, right? Lord Jesus Christ, he offers life. He died in our place.
He entered into our death to give us his resurrection life. And that exactly is the reason for a better you know, better behavior. You know, it almost sounds like we are arguing against good behavior. But unless you have the life of Christ, you really don't have the good behavior you are aiming at.
[00:19:19] Speaker A: Well, and even if you do have what appears to the world to be good behavior because of your effort, there's a Bible verse I think somewhere that says, my self righteousness is like filthy rags to God because I can't be righteous on my own apart from him, period.
[00:19:37] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And again, you know, when you think about good behavior, most of the time people think about, oh, I don't do this, I don't do that, I don't do that. But that's not right, you know, let's say if you are not doing all those things, what is it to me?
So the real good behavior that Bible talks about both in the Old Testament and even the New Testament is love, right? You love your neighbours, that's what is the good behavior that we are aiming at. But the difference is in the Old Testament you love your neighbour and love God as a condition. God, I'm going to love my neighbors first and therefore bless me, make me righteous. But now it's not that, it's our posture is the outcome is still love, but the way we do it is through Christ in us, right? You know, because he loved me first. We love because he loved us first. And the Lord Jesus Christ said, love one another even as I have loved you. What that means is he's telling you take my love for granted, right? God is loving us first just as I have loved you. You love others in this statement, right? If I wait to love you, right, I first have to know how God loved me because he's telling me, love others like I loved you, right?
But in the Old Testament there's nothing like, okay, love others like I loved you. They are just saying, love God and love one another, but nobody knows what it is. They don't know how to love one another. They don't even know what love is, right? Before in the Old Testament there was no cross.
But cross is the definition of love, right?
God loved us so much, right? God demonstrated his love for us even when we were still sinners. Christ died for us.
So that is the kind of love God is expecting in New Testament. And there's no way we can do it.
So it's not all about, oh, I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't do this, I don't do that. But are you loving your neighbor as Christ loved you? So that is a Standard even in the New Testament.
[00:21:45] Speaker A: So it's not just about your outward actions, the doing and not doing. It's about the inward motivations and the inward feelings and stuff like that. I have to love my neighbor as myself.
And by the way, search as I will in my Bible, I cannot find an asterisk next to that verse that says, well, you don't have to love these people or those people. That means I gotta love the people that did me bad. I gotta love the people that I am not attracted to, you know, in any sense of the word. Not like, you know, physical attraction or anything. But there are people out there that to me, I just don't mix with them, you know, and if it weren't for God, I couldn't love those people. And part of that love that I have now that I share with people I wouldn't have before is because God wants me to reach, help reach some of those people. So his message of love is coming out of me to them, and so is the message of the gospel coming out to them so that hopefully they too can be saved.
[00:22:47] Speaker B: Yes, yes, yes.
[00:22:48] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't believe that any be lost, right?
[00:22:51] Speaker B: Yep, yep, yep. In fact, you know, the greatest display of love is preaching the gospel, right? Because you can give somebody the whole world, but if you. If they don't know the gospel, they are still perishing. Like our Lord Jesus Christ said, you know, what profits a man if you gain the whole world? Let's say, you know, you give all your money, everything you have to somebody, but you don't give them the gospel.
Well, they have some material things, but their soul is still lost. So. So I would say, you know, I personally think giving the gospel to people is the greatest act of love, whether they realize it or not.
Tim, I also just wanted to say that, yeah, we used to. We kind of use the term, yeah, you have to love your neighbor under the new covenant. But it's not a law or it's not something, oh, I have to love you now. It's not that, you know, there are no laws.
One verse that came to my mind is in 2nd Corinthians, chapter 5 and verse 14.
For the love of Christ compels us because we judge thus. If one died for all, all died, and he died for all, that those who live should no longer live for themselves, but for him who died for them and rose again again. You know, this scripture almost sounds like, oh, yeah, you know, now I have to deny myself. I have to really try hard to live for Christ and not for myself.
But if you look at the verse before that, right, he's saying that we are now considering this. Right? This is how we judge ourselves. If one died for all, all died. What he's saying is we died with Christ on the cross. The old man died.
Now we live in the resurrection life of Christ.
And the nature of the resurrection life is to love. So our default mode is love. Without trying.
If we really understand and we identify ourselves with who we are in Christ, our nature itself is love. Just like a branch grafted in the vine. Right. You know, the same life, the same SAP goes through the branch as well. Right. You know, it's the same way, you know, when we are joined to Christ, when we identify ourselves with the resurrection of Lord Jesus Christ, the same love flows through us. You know, the reason why we are now preaching the gospel is nobody told us, nobody said, you have to go preach the gospel. It's the love of Christ that is compelling us. Right? And whoever hears this gospel, they'll be benefited by that and they will also come into the same resurrection life of our Lord Jesus Christ that we have now.
[00:25:32] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely.
Hey, Logan, we're. We're still talking about some of the same things here. Let me go through the next paragraph or two from that blog, because I think they'll. I think we're going to tie some of that piece up really well.
It starts here again. That's why so many people fear grace. They assume that if you remove pressure, loosen rules, and stop emphasizing performance, people will drift into compromise.
So holiness becomes something we try to enforce through fear, guilt, and religious control. But Scripture teaches us the opposite. It is not pressure that produces holiness, it's grace. Because Paul says in Titus 2, 11, 12, the grace of God has appeared, teaching us to say no to ungodliness and worldly passions and to live self controlled, uprightly and godly lives.
It doesn't exercise.
We're out of the verse now. Grace doesn't exercise sin.
Excuse me. Grace doesn't excuse sin.
It transforms desire. It doesn't ignore brokenness. It heals it. And it doesn't lose the standard. It changes the heart. So once again, like you're saying, it's not that we're getting new rules. It's not. Not even. We didn't even take all the rules and combine them into two. Love God, love one another. There are no rules. Rules. And people are not sure if they can live without those rules. But it's telling us here it's not about rules. It's about your heart. And God, Spirit's living in our heart and God is in us, with us.
[00:27:10] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. In fact, Tim, you know, if you think about it, if you make love a rule, it's not love anymore.
Love has to be out of your heart and free will.
So. And that's where, you know, they just go into all kinds of outward things, even though their heart is far away from what they're trying to do.
So you really can't force love. That's why, you know, Lord gives us free will at the expense of, you know, losing some people. Right. You know, they never come to Christ, but that's the only way love works.
[00:27:42] Speaker A: Agreed. Yeah, I don't like the. I don't relish the idea of waking up in the morning and looking at my wife and going, okay, well, I gotta love you again today. I don't have to do that. I wake up in the morning, morning, and I see her and I go, ah, there's my wife, you know, the love of my life. I'm thrilled to have her. So, yeah, you know, that's. That's the difference between enforcing and having it, well spring out of you.
[00:28:05] Speaker B: Yep, yep.
Well, I would say, Tim, let's go through rest of the post and maybe we can wrap it up. I think it's been 40, 50 minutes, I think.
[00:28:16] Speaker A: Yeah, we're getting there. We're getting there, sir. Okay.
Holiness doesn't grow from fear of punishment. It grows from love and belonging.
When we know we are forgiven, secure and accepted, obedience stops being forced and starts becoming natural.
As John says in 1 John 4:19, we love because he first loved us.
Love changes motivation. Identity changes behavior. Belonging reshapes desire.
Paul makes this clear when he says, sin shall no longer be your master because you are not under the law, but under grace. Romans 6:14. I think you said that one earlier already.
Grace doesn't strengthen sin, it breaks its power. And it doesn't produce rebellion, it produces freedom. It doesn't create compromise. It creates transformation.
And the last bit of this says, true holiness is not self produced. It is grace produced, not enforced by rules, not sustained by fear, but formed by love, identity, and the Spirit's transforming work within us. Grace doesn't make holiness optional. It makes it possible.
As we started this out with, Amen.
[00:29:34] Speaker B: Amen. Amen. Yeah.
Yeah. I am reminded of one verse, Tim.
Yeah. This is amazing, right? Like, all these things happen because of grace. You know, like we just read Romans 6:14.
Sin is not our master. So if sin is not our master, we don't obey sin. Right. If you're not obeying sin, you are obeying righteousness by default.
So grace will only produce the life, that life of Christ in us, simply put, and the life of love.
But, you know, I also wanted to quickly go to Second Corinthians, Chapter 3.
This is also one of our favorite chapters, especially of Mark.
He said, you know, he read it for years and years, and he still does that. So, you know, sometimes, you know, people might wonder, okay, okay, now we are under grace. And, okay, now we are supposed to love. You know, how do we do all this, right? You know, these guys are talking about, you know, love flowing through us, life flowing through us, grace teaching us to deny ungodliness.
But how do you really do that?
And it is very, very simple, right? You know, you already have this. You know, when identity changes, behavior changes. So our main, what is the right way, you know, main part or activity, for lack of better words, is, you know, understanding your identity. And how do we understand our identity? It is in the new covenant, right? You know, once we are saved, Christ himself is our identity. So in order to know your identity, you don't look at yourself, you have to look at Christ.
And that's what the Bible says. It's so beautiful here.
Second Corinthians, chapter three and verse 18.
But we all with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror, the glory of the Lord are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.
So as we are, as we behold our Lord Jesus Christ, right? And where do we behold him?
We behold him in the Scriptures, you know, you don't look at the sky and you don't look for visions and experiences. But in the Scripture, when we behold our Lord Jesus Christ, we are transformed into that same image by the Spirit. So here there are three entities, right? Ourselves, Lord Jesus Christ and the Spirit.
So when we put our eyes on the Lord Jesus Christ, when we behold our Lord Jesus Christ and we are transformed into his image, but the transformation is not happening by ourselves, right? We are not transforming ourselves as the Spirit of the Lord.
Our part is to simply behold the Lord Jesus Christ, just like we always do. And the Spirit transforms us. And sometimes we don't even realize, right? You know, our eyes are not on our behavior. You know, we are not tracking and measuring our behavior.
We are lost in our Lord Jesus Christ. And people will enjoy as a byproduct. You know, we are more loving to people. You know, we are not even intentional. But even after behavior is becoming better, you know, Our focus is not on our behavior, but we continue to gaze on our Lord Jesus Christ.
[00:33:03] Speaker A: Amen. Amen. Yep. That is one that we hear from Mark a lot, isn't it?
[00:33:07] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:33:10] Speaker A: How we almost got through the whole episode without talking about him, Ajay, I don't know.
All right, I will say this. At the end of the episode, I'll have to say, yeah, I agree with you. I. I kind of miss Mark tonight. So there you go.
[00:33:25] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:33:25] Speaker A: Hey, listen, why don't we take this opportunity. If you've got something you'd like to wrap the episode up with, I'll let you do that as soon as I do this.
And that is when I think about holiness and sanctification, I have to fall back immediately on. I was given those when I was saved.
What I haven't done, though, sanctification is still a process that my body.
My body is still sinful. I still live in a sinful body. So I still miss the mark. I still fall short. I still sin. I still error. I still break relationships and do bad things.
So I may not look sanctified on the outside, but I am on the inside. And so are you. If you've accepted Jesus, you've. You are also sanctified. So walk. Step into that sanctification. Walk in the holiness. The rest will follow. Man, it's. It. You know, you're. It's about not trying yourself, but trying. But just. There, I almost said trying again. But just live in the love that's coming out of you from God who's living within you.
Ajay.
[00:34:33] Speaker B: Yes, Tim? I'm glad you brought that up. Right. You know, when we say, okay, grace teaches us to deny ungodliness. And, you know, we will walk more and more in sanctification.
It doesn't mean that overnight we become like Jesus in our conduct. Of course, you know, we are already like our Lord Jesus Christ in the Spirit. Our spirit is brand new. But like you said, our body and our mind and our soul, they are still old. You know, the last I checked, I still have the old body, the same body that I had before I was saved. And the same memories, the same thought patterns, they are still there.
So it does take time. Right. You know, the main ministry of the Holy Spirit is renewing our mind through teaching us more and more of his love.
So the other thing I also wanted to mention is transformation looks different for everybody. Right. You know, for somebody who is born in a Christian family, they're brought up in a Christian way. And from the beginning, you know, they were not. They didn't, by God's grace, get into all kinds of things.
For them, the transformation may look like, okay, you know, you may not even realize, right? It will be more inward because outwardly, maybe you're not doing anything.
But for somebody who came from a broken family, you know, who came from the streets, right. You know, who didn't have a dad, who didn't have a mom to bring them up like some of the other fortunate kids had, it might be totally different, right? For them, even though the transformation is huge, outwardly, it might look like, oh, my God, what is this guy doing? Right? It might look like, oh, there's no transformation at all. But if you really compare, probably the transformation for the guy who is on the streets is probably much more than the transformation for the guy who is brought up in a Christian family. So we should not just compare each other. I think it's more like where we started and where we are going and where we are, and it's totally between us and the Lord. It's not us to judge each other.
[00:36:47] Speaker A: Do you ever feel any jealousy of people who had such great testimonies because they came from such horrible backgrounds?
I grew up and went, who? I don't know if I want to go through what they went through to have a good testimony. So I'll take what I got, my friend. I'll take what I got. Well, listen up, everybody. This is the end of today.
We've successfully made it with or without Mark. I know he's here in spirit, but if you're missing him, please join us again here next week and we will talk to you then.
Thanks for listening today. We hope you were a encouraged and uplifted. If so, we encourage you to subscribe and share our podcast with your friends and family.
You can listen and subscribe on most popular podcast apps.
Well, that's it for us today. As always, God bless and we will talk to you the next time.
[00:37:47] Speaker B: All days of my life.
